Guiding True Political Reform in the State of New York
20 May
I love New York. But how much should it cost to call New York home? Decades of out of control budgets, spending increases and relentless borrowing have made New York simply too expensive.
Politicians like to talk about incentives: incentives for businesses to relocate, incentives to buy local and incentives to make smart decisions. After reviewing the 2009 budget I have identified the most compelling incentive of all: a major tax break immediately available to all New Yorkers. To be eligible, you need only do one thing: move out of New York State.
Last week I spent 90 minutes doing a couple of simple things—registering to vote, changing my drivers license, filling out a domicile certificate and signing a homestead certificate—in Florida. Combined with spending a 184 days a year outside New York these simple procedures will save me over $5 million in NY taxes annually.
That savings doesn’t include that Florida has a 6% sales tax compared to NY’s 8% or more. Florida has lower utility taxes. Lower gasoline taxes. Or that the Florida homestead certificate guarantees my property taxes will not grow more than 3%.
By moving to Florida I can spend that money on worthy causes like better hospitals, improving education and worthy projects like the Clinton Global Initiative. Or maybe I will continue to invest that money in fighting the status quo in Albany. One thing is certain, that money will not continue to fund Albany’s bloated bureaucracy, corrupt politicians or regular handouts to the special interests.
How did we get here in the first place? It all starts with spending, spending and more spending.
BUDGET SPENDING
New York’s budget was $72.7 billion in 1999. Ten years later it has ballooned to $131.8 billion. That growth is astounding but it continues to get worse. Each year, New York’s budget has had 6% compounded growth, double the average rate of inflation (2.8%). Florida’s budget, on the other hand, went down 8% this year.
HEALTH CARE SPENDING
New York spends $2,283 per person on Medicaid. That’s the highest per capita spending in the nation and twice the national average. In the last decade the Medicaid budget has grown by 50% ($30 billion in 1999 and $45 billion in 2009). In almost every sector (hospitals, nursing homes, medicine, clinics, and home and community care) spending per recipient regularly exceeds the national average.
Faced with escalating costs and diminishing returns, Albany and their allies, the health care unions (SEIU has over 300,000 politically active members), had only one answer: increase taxes.
EDUCATION SPENDING
New York spends the most, per pupil, in America on education, spending 63% above the national average. Costs went up about 60% in the last decade ($12.7 billion in 1999 and $20.7 billion in 2009). Like health care, education is something worth spending on and worth investing in but we’re spending more and getting less. New York City schools graduated 54% of high school students in 2007. Buffalo 47% and Rochester 45%.
Why? Perhaps it’s because the New York State teachers union with its $114 million budget is always trying to convince Albany to spend more. Maybe it’s because it’s mandatory that all teachers pay union dues. Whatever the cause, when faced with potential cuts, the union and their allies have one response: increase taxes.
LOCAL GOVERNMENT SPENDING
It’s not just the state. It’s the range and breadth of many layers of governments and special taxing districts. In New York, the average state and local tax burden is $5,260 for every man, woman and child. That’s by far the highest in the country. Like Albany, when faced with a difficult problem, these municipalities have one answer: increase taxes.
Upstate New York has been particularly hard hit. Add unreasonable real estate taxes to the uncontrolled state spending and you have whole communities decimated. The assessment process is unfair, unworkable and unreasonable and the result is that 15 of the 20 highest taxed counties in America are right here in Upstate New York. While homeowners in other areas build equity, we just pay more taxes.
NO ONE’S HOME
This problem did not begin with the current recession. New York faced a $6 billion shortfall before the economic downturn. However in the face of economic turmoil Governor Paterson, Speaker Silver and Majority Leader Smith looked to the unions and special interests who answered with one voice: raise taxes.
Among other taxes and fees, they raised the marginal tax rate on the most successful (and most mobile) New Yorkers to 8.97 percent, the second highest rate in the nation.
It was irresponsible and it may just prove to be counterproductive since the top 1% of earners account for about 50% of state revenue. We’re the one who can—and will—leave.
It’s not an easy decision but I’m being forced away from my family and friends, pain shared by too many parents and grandparents in this state.
I’m leaving. And by domiciling in Florida I will personally save $13,800 every single day. That’s a pretty strong incentive.
Like I said, I love New York but I’m not going to pay any more for the waste, corruption and inefficiency that is New York State government.
91 Responses for "Why I’m Leaving New York (but still trying to change it)"
Thanks for continuing to fight for all of us, Tom! I Love NY too but wish we could all move on the same day. Had more people listened to you sooner, we wouldn’t be in this mess!!
Thanks for the update, Tom. Unfortunately I believed that you were one of the last hopes for NYS and since reading about your departure, I think we’re doomed. Yesterday I announced my own five-year-bail-out plan, which is also known as the good-bye, farewell, hasta la vista plan! That’s right in June of 2014 my 7th grader graduates and I’m leaving. I don’t care where, but I have absolutely no faith that our State Government can change their dysfunctional tax and spend ways. They’re living in the world where their sole purpose is reelection and catering to the unions and special interests. Meanwhile you helped the Democrats take over the Senate and now we’ve got Three Democrats in the Room rather than Three Men in the Room. We’re even worse off with these three than we were with the other three. So good luck to you and as I posted on my own blog - rich people didn’t get rich by being stupid and you certainly are not. Why spend $13,000 a day if you don’t have to?
I was ready for Tom to take the reins as governor. This is not good news, but I wish him well during his transition to Florida and his next career move(s).
-Gary Smith
Toughing it out in Albany
All I have to say is that if I had children, I’d much rather they go to school in New York State than Florida! We get what we pay for in NY, and that includes good schools, small class sizes, qualified teachers and a variety of programs for all children. The numbers represented for graduating students is misleading; there is a lower percentage of graduating students in urban schools, not because of poor teaching or poor programming. If you have an complaints about the money spent on education, they should be focused on excessive amounts of money spent on over testing, much of which is useless to the student’s learning.
Tom……I’m leaving NY for the same reasons! I’m not however leaving my beloved Yankees though! Tom
I have noted with interest that by sheer number the illegal immigrants in this country are to a large extent able to avoid prosecution. In other words we can’t put them all in jail. Using the same logic what we we all decided to stop paying NY taxes until the current leadership resigns and agrees to leave NY for good. Failing that why not have some AIG type demonstrations in front of the homes of the big 3 plus the union presidents and let them know we want our state back. Enough is enough already. As to the teachers union member who posted the note above about we get what we pay for. All I can say is New Hampshire,for example, has no income tax but their education system surpasses ours by virtually every measure. We get what we pay for? You must have been educated in NY.
One thing (actually there are many things) that Tom understands and the parasites in NYC and Albany don’t is this: higher taxes = less revenue. If higher taxes worked, they wouldn’t have to keep raising them. And rich people, who bear the brunt of the increases, can always leave - and they do - along with a lot of other folks. New York has lost population while many other states have gained it.
I too was hoping that Tom would run for governor and smash the union power that has helped to bankrupt this state. But he must do what is good for him. I hope alot of other people follow right behind him.
There is hope: California just voted down a slew of tax increases and is forcing the parasites to balance the budget by cuts. Maybe there is hope for New York yet and we will vote out Patterson, Bloomberg, Smith, and Silver. The unions own these cowards and they feed off of the productive citizens. Well. we can only hope.
Good luck Tom.
Bravo!
I look forward to Mr. Alesi’s and Mr. Koon’s responses.
Tom,
Sad to see you go… but using the words “I’m being forced away from my family and friends”, personally does not resonate with me. If I were a billionaire and your age - I would personally rather pay $13,000+ per day to spend the rest of my life around my family and friends rather to move away to save what amounts to a drop in the barrel.
Regardless, I am happy to see that you will continue to fight for us.
-Tom
Its one big Ponzie scheme at both the federal and state level. The politicians have it jury-rigged and just play us - what is happening at the federal level is getting disturbing.
When busy people finally take the time to stop being productive to insist that others are and
when everyday hard working people stand up for their rights in the middle of their busy day we may begin to wrestle some control back - but it requires a constant year after year effort.
Barrney Frank recently referred to his position as being his profession - that IS the problem and that is the mind set. What ever happened to public service?
Belle is correct! Our politicians ARE COWARDS.
However, as great as these forums are, more people have to band together and vote these people out. Every election I vote to get these people out and “somehow?!” they retain their seats.
All of us, as concerned taxpayers of this state, have to stick together and “clean house”. Our voices have to be heard! Let’s all keep the ball rolling with the Tea Party demonstrations, etc.
Mr. Golisano, please don’t abandon us. We are going to need your help.
Dear Tom,
Good luck on the move. I am sure that many who would have an opportunity, such as yours, to move….would. Not many are as fortunate as you.
On Tuesday I went out to vote against the School Budget because a 5% increase is just another slap in our face when we cannot afford the property taxes we are currently paying. Many will be in jeopardy of losing their homes for failure to pay property taxes next…
Yet we were defeated because people who are not financially hurting yet….care little if at all for those who are….and no one shows up to vote except those who continue to SPEND.
Many will be leaving New York State….after they lose eveything they have….because they did not take any action on stopping the increase in property taxes and the frivoulous spending because it has not affected them yet.
Spending your money wisely, especially during times like this, requires no explanation….because it is just plain Common Sense.
My wife and I have been struggling to deal with the tax burden here in upstate and I just had the straw land that will break my back. I recieved notice that my protest to have a 2006 tax penalty waived has been denied. I had paid my 2006 taxes in full yet a little late in july of 2007. When I paid them I also paid the interest and penalty in full. So now in 2009 they are saying I owe an additional penalty for 2006. I protested with all my evidence they denied it….enough is enough I AM LEAVING!!!!!!
Tom. you didn’t mention the out-of-line State Pension System. this is where civil servents retire with a greater pension than their annual salary when they were working. the pension is state tax free & then they move out of state because it’s too expensive to live here. [I have a brother-in-law who did this.] now that the economy has droped the value of the stock market the State wants us to pay more taxes to bring the value of the NYS Pension fund back to the pre-market drop days. the State should institute an AUSTERITY BUDGET. cut back spending across the board, layoffs, benefits & demotions. But, this will never happen because we are saddled with all self-serving politicians. Good-bye & good luck.
Tom, I need your help on this one. It seems we are always dealing with the here and now with the total mess that is political reality. We are constantly allowing those in power to try getting us out of it, in one way or another, which is a never occuring story.
Why is it that the focus is not on the decisions that got us to this place and hold those who brought us here accountable. Lord knows they are still in office. If that analysis of past errors of judgement was held up to the light of scrutiny, in detail, perhaps then we could learn from our mistakes as well, at the voting booth. Memories are so short, but if brought out in a focused display, perhaps then we could get somewhere. What we need is a “blame game” on steroids.
Good luck with your first summer in FL, you be spending some of that 13K on air conditioning.
Tom,
Those that are remaining under the crushing cost of living and marginal performance by our many “governments” will miss you.
Sadly, the remaining residents of New York State are suffering under the “three men in a room” inefficiency and their agnostic ethics views. No state is pure, but NYS and Illinois battle it out for the most legislators in jail.
Thanks for your generosity to our many local service organizations.
And thanks for trying to stir up the apathetic private sector in NYS. But too many seem happy living in “The People Republic of New York”. They genuinely believe that “if it’s expensive, it must be good”, rather than “if it’s managed effectively and ethically, it’s more likely to be good”.
I blame Albany, but I also accuse my fellow citizens of failing to hold elected officials personally accountable.
We need your guidance on how to fix that.
Dave
Mr. Golisano has not became the man he is by letting people arrange his plate, and telling him what to eat.
The biggest complaint I have is a lack of interest from US citizens in the political arena.
AMERICANS - Please do everyone that cares on here a favor, turn off your American Idol and Reality TV and focus your time and energy on things more productive in your local communities.
Thank you.
Tom Thank you for your tremendous efforts in the past. You will be missed.I wish you well in all your future enterprises. It will be amusing to see how the TAX/SPEND & BORROW GOVERNING MORANS react to the results from raising taxes on the top 1% and lowering total tax revenue.The answer of course will be additional taxes. Good Luck
Tom Thank you for your tremendous efforts in the past. You will be missed.I wish you well in all your future enterprises. It will be amusing to see how the TAX/SPEND & BORROW GOVERNING bodies react to the results from raising taxes on the top 1% and lowering total tax revenue.The answer of course will be additional taxes. Good Luck
Tom Thank you for your tremendous efforts in the past. You will be missed.I wish you well in all your future enterprises. It will be amusing to see how the TAX/SPEND GOVERNING bodies react to the results from raising taxes on the top 1% and lowering total tax revenue.The answer of course will be additional taxes. Good Luck with the Florida heat
Tom - Good Luck. Your decision along with the same decision by many New Yorkers makes sense. It has taken too many years to realize that Democrate and Republican legislators do not represent the private sector in this state. Both parties represent the Unions. There is not an in incumbent in this state that deserves to return to Albany. We need to get out and vote everyone of our legislators out of office. Democracy is a great privilege if we excercise our right to vote. Our elected officials represent the government and teachers unions.
Good luck Tom, I wish I could leave also !! Unfortunately I have 9 more years before I retire and then I’ll relocate also. I think New York has too many politicians that don’t have the best interest of our working class men and woman at heart.
Tom - Great job in continuing the fight against excessive government spending in New York…. please keep fighting for NY!
I think that every elected official should have to demonstrate that they have successfully run a business in the private sector before they take office. They have no clue what is involved and what is even worse, they don’t care.
In the 2009 Business First Book of Lists, the top 10 employers in WNY account for 77,657 jobs. Of that 31,530 are state, federal and county employees. Government is much too large and sucks the life out of the competitive environment in NYS. I don’t blame Tom for leaving.
Tom:
Good luck in sunny Fla…I tried it for 3 yrs and moved back to NY. Because of your wealth, you will be fine but it was very hard to find good paying work in Fla. The schools suck, teachers don’t really get involved and are very transient as are most of the population. Crime is bad but you won’t hear much about it nationally because its a tourist state and they can’t afford to have the truth said about what’s really happening. The home prices for an average family are way out of whack and the hospitals are good but not as good as NY. The hurricanes will scare you for 6 months, the heat will become unbearable as you’ll be living in A/C all the time and the traffic during Jan-April is slow and heavy. Now this is one persons opinion, but I love the lilac’s and the four seasons of weather change and just wait till you go to a grocery store and see how much you miss Wegamans/Topps. It not all that it’s built up to be..Try and get homeowners insurance cheap..not happening but good luck. We hate to see you leave but in your case I can’t blame you. But one thing for sure, your leaving will not change the way Alabny is run and I’d wish you’d stay and fight for us New Yorkers. Don’t get caught up in any rip currents and I hope you don’t mind alot of bugs…..And I hope you know spanish….
Sincerely,
Dave Stasaitis
Rochester, NY
Tom, Thank you for all you have done for the Upstate New York area. I have been a commercial banker for most of my career and have been very frustrated with the declining economy in Upstate New York. We love living here, but professionally it’s been a struggle when so many businesses continue to leave Upstate New York.
What really makes me mad is when a New York State employees can retire in their mid-50’s with full pension and healthcare benefits and that type of compensation simply doesn’t exist within the private sector. Is Albany here to serve the people or serve themselves??? On top of that the waste in this state is unbelievable. How many pet projects have gone down the tubes due to Albany’s incompetence.
Finally, the best way to make a change is to put TERM LIMITS on the ballot for New Yorkers to decide. Sheldon Silver and his cronies need to step aside and allow fresh ideas to be brought to the NYS legislative process.
[...] Matt at May 21st, 2009 I couldn’t help noticing that Tom Golisano, in explaining why he is leaving New York, said that his tax dollars “will not continue to fund Albany’s bloated bureaucracy, [...]
My wife and I will be soon in a position to retire, we are already looking to find another state in which to live. I love upstate New York, however, it is turning into a SWEAT SHOP for the state government. The governing body of this state is criminal in its action against the upstate taxpayer. We may have great schools, but we simply pay a horrible price to educate students to be employed in other states. We are becoming more and more unatractive to investments from companies as we witness with the exodus. Paterson and all the rest of the governing body need to resign. They stink! They are white collar self-serving criminals, equal to the Wall ST. BANKSTERS. We are their slave labor. Yes, I am mad as hell!
Why would anyone expect addicts to voluntarily subject themselves to withdrawal? Money, and the power to collect it, is addictive. Every bit as addictive as heroin. Every addict knows it won’t hurt to do it “just one more time”. And we all know how the scenario plays out: Nothing changes for an addict until they “hit bottom”.
Our state legislature is addicted. We are slowly heading for the bottom and they know it, but can’t stop themselves. The unions and other “pushers” provide the incentive to keep using OUR money. We all know who is responsible, yet a majority of us continue to send the same cast of characters to Albany. With all addictions, the future is not pretty.
Tom Golisano has worked at this from every angle over the years with spotty success. Who can blame him for opting out of the cycle of tax-and-spend?
Tom, can’t say I don’t agree with your move. Not so sure FL is the place. There are some expenses down there that are far greater than here–most notorious is homeowner’s insurance. My wife and I have entertained the idea of leaving once we retire, as we are not in a position to do so now. SC and TN are two possible choices as is my understandiing they are less expensive than FL. We have all been complaining what seems like decades about NY’s overtaxation. They just don’t get it. You cannot expect the state to prosper by taxing and spending to make up for a deficit. Did they ever stop to consider that if they lowered the cost of living/doing business here that MORE revenue would flow in because the population and business would increase, thus generating more revenue per entity !!!
I am right behind Tom ! Marching out of this state, if I can? The problem for me is that high property taxes are holding me prisoner here. I have several properties and no one wants to buy them because they are located in NYS.
When you remove the incentive to excel you get justifications such as Michelle is offering. The truth is when you have a job for life, with guaranteed increases and there is no caparisons made to your peers why should you perform? You wouldn’t make any more money. The whole state operates this way.
NYS infuriates me every time they stick their hand in my pocket again. When you have three people constructing the budget and they are all of one party, I do not hold out any hope for any tax relieve. With peoples’ lifestyles and the economy itself is retreating and shrinking, our governor has the audacity to propose a budget with a 9% increase over last year’s. This shows the mindset of our governor and state legislators, all they understand is increased taxation, no matter how many hard working, productive people it drives out of this state.
I applaud the idea but suggest you read “The New York Residency Audit Handbook” written by attorneys Paul Comeau and Mark Klein.
Regardless of how few days you spend in NYS, if you own property and/or businesses here, there is an excellent chance of you being declared a resident.
NYS looks at those actions as cosmetic and meaningless. Get a copy of the 29 question NYS NONRESIDENT AUDIT LONG QUESTIONAIRE.
[...] decided to leave the Empire State: Tom Golisano, owner of the Buffalo Sabres and CEO of Paychex. He explained his decision, "Decades of out of control budgets, spending increases and relentless borrowing have made New [...]
In my household, when less money is anticipated to come in via earned income, we cut back on spending. Responsible government should do the same.
However, the same people that are electing these morons in our state govenment are the ones that have gotten this counry into this economic mess in the first place. It begs the question, which came first….the fiscally irresponsible individual or the fiscally irresponsible government? I personally think they feed off eachother!
Tom,
My union NYSCOPBA brought several suggestions to the Governor on how to save money, all of which were ignored !!
Mr. G. I am torn on your exit to the Sunshine State. Your generous help of Strong Hospital has helped my Children and I will always be grateful to you for that. On the other hand, I can not understand why, in the last election you supported Obama and many other tax and spend Liberals here in New York State. Can you understand my confussion ? Thank you for all of the great things you have done for Western New York. Good Luck, Sam.
Under the current incarnation of NY, the best message we can give our kids is to GET OUT. NY is a great state but is run by a government that is so disconnected with what it means to live free and fiscally responsible. The only way to change this system is to not only vote out the self serving group that already presides but to vote in people who are NOT the lifelong politicians that are standing behind our currently elected, waiting for a chance to set up their empire. We need elected officials that are truly rooted in the idea that they are serving their people, NOT THEIR political affiliation.
I don’t blame you one bit.
Good Morning Tom,
I understand your reasoning for leaving and I wish you well. Obviously we need to weed out this government, but doing it is much harder than tallking about. Like seeming everything in life, The first thing needed is money. I know you have gone over the top with your share of funding for this effort already. But now you are being singled out by our enemies for being “greedy” Why not close their mouths and dedicate that 13,000K per day tax savings back into this organization? Then challenge the top 1% to match it. 4.75 million a year from 25 to 50 of them would clean out this rat’s nest pretty quickly
Re: Irresponsible New York State
Mr. Golisano,
I applaud you. You show more collective wisdom than all of the politicians in Albany combined. I can see how frustrated you were when you presented your opinions on this critical issue in Albany not too long ago. Unfortunately, our politicians didn’t want to hear this.
At a time when businesses and investors are hurting, New York’s legislature passed a budget to increase spending by 8 1/2%. What a total disregard for tax payers. To pay for it, they tax the wealthy.
Having been born, raised, educated and spending my whole life in N.Y. State, I too am now ready to leave.
George W. Karpus
President & CEO
Karpus Investment Management
Hopefully, this will attract many more to fight for what’s right for NYS. Where does one go to learn and understand the issues?
Hello Tom,
I admire your actions! I wish that it was possible for me to do the same thing! I currently have a job that I need to hang on too. Over the last twenty five years my standard of living has contiued to drop. I am a home owner and I too am frustrated with the lack of accountibility of our states government. I personally do not think that there is one area of our government that has not been impacted by inflated spending. I also feel that our communities are suffering from lack of governmental support.
I wish you well, but hope that you will contiue to fight for our beautiful state of New York.
Tom,
I agree with everything you wrote in your letter. NY will only get worse, unless there is a total upheaval of the political environment occurs.
I understand why you are leaving and would do the same. One day, after my kids are grown, I will be leaving NY State for good.
Wow!
Do you really think that the common man can relate to you and your “problem”? You are talking about amounts of money ($5M) that most of will not earn in a life time. I am sure, however, that $5M is a drop in your financial bucket, but don’t let the state that allowed you to get rich have any of it back. Or did daddy leave you the money?
Is it sour grapes because the people would not elect you governor? Are you “taking your ball and going home”?
You are like Count Dracula - you suck a body dry and then move on with no concern for what you have left behind.
If you think New York was messed up, I can’t wait until you get a belly full of Florida politics.
I agree with you Tom, but I’m not leaving NY State because with Obama’s policies it’s only a matter of time before every state will look like New York! If I move at all it will be out of the country.
Good luck to you & your family!
Tom, I would guess that the only reason it took so long was your asperations to change the policies of New York by running for office. I (a fellow Rochester native) too left NY and reside in Florida and also Arizona. I believe that the only possible changes to the extremely high income, sales, and property taxes is Revolution (or possibly leaving the state). Money cannot solve all problems and certainly not until all citizens and lawmakers take responsibility for the problem. The beginning of which is acknowledgement that there is a tax problem in NY–which hasn’t happened in NY yet.
Upstate NY was a lovely place to raise my children but is out of touch with reality when it comes to enticing in or even holding onto its businesses or residents.
It is a shame!
Without a 1776-style revolution, how else will NYS change? NYS taxes . . . It’s like a second mortgage. My new house commands more taxes than my mortgage on my first house. F___ing ridiculous!!
Tom,
Sorry to hear you are going but at the same time, envy your ability to choose. We have been waiting to leave NY for years and as the youngest family member heads towards graduation, we plan on moving soon there after. Maybe Albany will start listening a bit closer to the taxpayers pain when heavy hitters like you walk away in search of a healthier bottom line. Look at the stats on who are leaving upstate; it’s not just retirees anymore. It’s thew old and the young; the working class and retired running out of NYS. My fear is, when the opportunity arises for us to go, we’ll be the last one here!!! Don’t forget upstate Tom. There are a lot of us who would drive out of this state arm in arm with you if we could right now……
Tom,
I can’t leave until my kids are out of school, but in 10 years at a young 58, I am right behind you. The NY politicians can have it all to themselves. I wish I had moved elsewhere after college. I encourage every young person I come across to go live in another state.
Tim
Go for it!
Wished we could. We are retired but if we leave NYS for more than 3 months, our health insurance is null and void.
Our dream was to buy a few acres with a little house. The sad thing, we can afford the house and 2 acres but can’t afford the taxes of $7000-$8000 a year. This is a $200,000 or under ranch house.
Its ridiculous. Gov. Patterson has got to go. with Mr. G moving, no chance of him being the Gov. He surely would win in the next election.
too bad we will never have our dream home unless we move to East Podunk and put a travel trailer on it.
I hope every independently wealthy New York that can, leaves. The what will those idiots in Albany do? There is little left to tax and when we are all finally broke, then perhaps the people will rise up, throw the bums out and retake our government and our beautiful state.
The current leadership in Albany and Washington is so enamored of their relationship with organized labor that they cannot see the truth, the damage they are doing or the reality of our situation.
I was born in Rochester and I lived in NY (Rochester, Syracuse and Utica) for 35 years. I now live in FL. My 9 year old son goes to an amazing school. His reading level is almost 7th grade level in 3rd grade. 86 % of the 3rd grade at his school meets or excedes level and he goes to public school. So, to the woman (Michelle C)who made the comment about the schools - I strongly disagree. I have checked the stats on my old schools in Rochester. Never in a million years would I send my child to those public schools. Way to make a statement, Tom!!!
Tom,
Gee, maybe you’ll think twice before you support Democrats again. Just goes to show you that they’ll tell you whatever you want to hear to get your money. I didn’t think you were that gullable but I guess I was wrong.
We spent $600,000 for a beautiful new home in a gated community in Lakewood Ranch Florida in 2002 - Sarasota area. Our taxes are less than $6000. We are in a golfing, country club setting. Pro baseball players live in our community. Dick Vitale has a 15,000 sf mansion one street behind us. We lived in NY and watched the Cuomo era. That was enough to send us packing.
I’m with you Tom. The result will be counter productive. Wish I could leave. In fact I wish I would have left NY many years ago. Teerm limits is the only answer. Watch out for your assumption on the 184 day rule. NY will do everything possible to track your days and try and attribute taxable earnings to you for every day you are in NY. Consult with Rush Limbaugh and see how they got him even though he was not a NY resident. In fact he was commenting about your decision the other day and he also warned you to be aware that they will try and tax you for every day you spend in NY.
What about the wastefull and corrupt private contractors. Between them and the bloodthirsty unions im not surprised the budget doubled in 10 years.
Tom, I was born and raised in W. NY and worked in Rochester until 1980 when I took a job in Tennessee with my same company, then again in Portland OR. I love NY. Part of the complacency of the W. NY voters is that they still hang on to this Northern superiority complex that Southerners are dumb and backwards and West Coasters are all nuts. While you have been sitting back and bragging about your superior wages and benefits and “smart” education systems the South has risen again. While I was in TN, International Paper moves to Memphis then follows Kraft foods…why if we are so superior? The picture of Rochester in 1980 that I had when I moved away is not very pretty any more. It’s stinking ugly in our downtown (Portland OR is stunning and successful in comparison and the city center has the most expensive homes, (they move to places like Pittsford or Fairport for the cheap housing there) and I would like to see where the nearly 30 years of growth is in Rochester. You couldn’t have spent much time elsewhere in other attractive US cities like Charlotte, Portland OR, Austin TX, Virginia Beach, Raleigh, Nashville TN, and on if you truly believe we have so many advantages here because of the taxes we pay. My observation of Rochester after moving back here 5 years ago is that this area has experienced zero growth since 1980. The assumptions that we have the most educated, best wages, and some how more “services” is a myth. Because my taxes in TN and OR were lower, I some how had to send my children to inferior schools and I suffered from a lack of services is just “liberal” nonsense.
I experienced substantial capital gains on the 3 homes that I lived in out of state, which included gains because of lower property taxes and community growth. Get a grip Rochester, you are living in the past and until you give people who are not paid by the government incentive to bring their work and business here it will just continue to decay. Big government and big unions will not bring prosperity and growth, nor keep our productive citizens here. Perhaps after Rochester has 75% of its population on the government payroll and 25% unemployment being supported by “services” we won’t need any elections at all.
I totally agree with you Tom. I moved out of NY when Hilary Clinton took residence. I saw it coming a long time ago and took action. Too many people think the grass roots movements don’t know what they’re talking about. It’s the grass roots movements fighting hard and spreading the word to common people to make us all aware of the truth behind government corruption and lies. We are loosing everything America stood for and once was. The people and only the people of America can do something about it. It is hard to believe what one person can do. One person with a voice and the internet can do alot. Tell everyone, talk, talk, talk. Spread the word. Some say we are crazy. It will never become that bad. How much worse do we need to get before those same people realize we are in a major crisis and it is our own government doing it to us? Research. Do your own research. Get your head out of the sand and start looking things up. You will be devastated just how bad things really are and what is happening to all of us without our knowledge or consent. We are loosing America, our Constitution, our way of life, our rights, our homes, our jobs, and soon our voice. Are we going to sit back and stay in denial until it happens? I’m certainly not and haven’t for years. Educate yourselves. We are easy sheep because we don’t take responsibility for our situation. We are leaving it to the people in government to take care of it for us. They are doing a poor job and sticking to their agenda, not ours. They even went so far as to say we are loosing our social security and pensions due to the baby boomers. How many illegal aliens are using deceased taxpapers social security numbers and cleaning up? Ever wonder why they are doing better than we are? Where is their money coming from? You and me. The government is sending out stimulus checks to deceased people but I never got one. I wonder why that is? I go to McDonalds and I can barely place an order because they speak heavily broken English and I must repeat my order until they understand me. Drug cartels are all over our country thanks to Mexico’s lack of border control. According to Homeland Security, we don’t have this problem. They are arresting and jailing border patrol agents for doing their jobs. Residents along the border do not want a fence. Why? Groups like the Minute Men who volunteer their time and services to assist the border parol in manpower and volunteering to supply materials and labor to build the fence are denied by our government. The Minute Men have been declared a Grass Roots movement we should not support. Why? Ask yourself why? What can I do to help save my Country? my home? my job? my Constitution? My Flag? our American way of life? Use your voice, do the research, knowledge is power. This is not the time to be naive. Naive is not bliss.
Sorry to see you go. Wish I could leave too but family, etc. keeps me here. I believe a tax payer revolt will happen and hope voters will “kick the bums out”. We need a New Progressive Era with Recall and term limits for all legislators. I wouldn’t mind seeing NY City secede and become its own state (yeah right!). That would help all of us in upstate NY.
I hope you continue to make yourself heard in NY even from Florida. Good luck and thanks for all the inormation and making New Yorkers aware of how Albany is changing NY from the Empire State to the Empty State.
Great for you…but what about all of us who can’t leave?
I truly understand Tom’s frustration with Albany, and I also agree with Debbie Fitts’ comment.
My wife and I were away from NYS for 27 years living in Arkansas and North Carolina. We put up with tornados, hurricanes, treacherous ice conditions in winter, multiple months of triple digit heat indexes during the summers, and almost a third of the year with code orange, red and purple ozone days.
We decided to move back to Rochester November 2005 because this is HOME for us. It’s very discouraging to hear of college graduates, Tom Golisano, and others leaving the state. Don’t people realize that the exodus of people and industry out of NYS is also part of the problem! And yes, Albany doesn’t get it either.
Lower number of residents and industries contribute to lower tax base. There’s just so much that can be cut out of budgets in order to keep taxes lower. The public’s demand for ever increasing services costs money, and until everyone realizes that - the state will NOT be able to combat rising taxes. The public at large needs to put their special interests aside and work toward a better solution. A case in point - people don’t want wind farms in their “back yards”, yet that is a way to reduce energy costs in the long run. Hello — it also might help increase a tax base by making it more affordable for industries to do business in the state.
It’s a shame to know that Tom is saving $13,000 plus per day by moving to Florida. It’s a good example of the ever widening gap between the upper, middle and lower income classes not only in NYS, but across the nation as well. Our combined family income is far less than the $250K/yr. level, and quite frankly, I’m tired of the upper 1% - 20% not paying their fair share of taxes, or having millions tax sheltered offshore. We all need to be part of a solution to higher taxes.
I don’t begrudge the Tom Golisanos in this state of their success, or the hard word that many of them invested to get there. What I do begrudge them for is forgetting where they came from - not all millionaires were born that way - and giving up on the quest to work toward making NYS the best state we can be.
Tom,
Well done, hopefully your money will go to worthy causes.
We need to get some people in office that care about people and not themselves. If you really work at spending less you will succeed, I have done it in corporate America for years. Unfortunately it requires Albany to stand up to special interests and make them earn their business……
Go Sabres…
Mr. Golisano, I’m glad you are able to make this statement. I hope you will continue to push for the right things once you have gone. I, too, own property in Florida and will, one day, leave NY state. The taxes are ridiculous here. I am in no way any where near your income level or tax bracket, however, all things are relative and we are all being devoured by our own tax system here in NY. Our NY government has made a mess of things. We pay outrageous taxes and get very little in return. The working person can’t possibly get ahead. We need to vote these people out of office and take back our great state. Put these taxes out with the government that brought them here! Best of luck to you. Marie Long
Hi Tom, I wish you and your family nothing but the very best in your smart move to Florida. Thank you for what you have tried to do for all of us who still live here in New York State. The politicians in Albany, as well as in Washington, JUST DO NOT GET IT!!!! The Albany machine has driven out every Fortune 500 Company we’ve had here; who have taken the jobs with them. We had well over 500 companies in NYS around 1989 and I can’t name one now. If we the people have to live witin our means then so should government! Within the next three years I’m going to be gone from New York too. I was born and raised here but enough is enough… I can’t afford New York State any longer. I believe in miracles but the New York politicians turning their wasteful spending around isn’t one of them. The only people I see immigrating to New York these days are the ones looking for a hand out…and why not, they’ll get it! I don’t point many fingers at the majority of our political representatives from Western New York as I do believe they are trying to represent us and they do the best they can. However, the greedy money spending politicians from downstate, who out number our representatives, is another story and they could care less about this end of the state. I do hope the Tea Party movement can wake-up some of these downstate politicians before it’s too late and we see another Revolution in this country!!! It has been proven that history does repeat itself…
GOD Bless you Tom
Mr. Golisano,
I hope that current and future politicians pay attention to your actions. What a loss for our state - may ALL be reminded each time a “Golisano Children’s Hospital” is passed or needed. You have accomplished more in your life than any NYS elected official has done in mine. Your efforts have been and are appreciated. Best wishes. Pam
Left NY two years ago after generations of my family had lived there. In fact, ALL of my wife’s and my siblings remain there, as do our parents.
Years ago, there were a number of celebrated relocations of headquarters operations out of NY. Xerox went to CT., WR Grace to Florida, etc. What did the state do in response? Nothing.
NY doesn’t have a lock on good schools anymore. Streets are not safer there. The thousands of college grads generated from that state find it hard to find work. Home ownership is expensive and appreciation is behind the national norms. And there’s a general cynicism and malaise that infects so many of the struggling rural areas.
NY is also one of the most beautiful states in America and has people who are warm and kindly to each other - contrary to how we have been characterized in the press. The geographic wonders are plenty, from great lakes and Niagara Falls to the Finger Lakes, Adirondacks, Catskills and the Hamptons.
Alas, history and beauty will not sustain the state formerly known as Empire. Those of us with options to move where opportunity is are doing fine elsewhere - and keeping more of our earnings.
NY has had the opportunity to elect a Governor with clear leadership success and chose political hacks instead. Losing the man who should have been in Albany to steer us through this crisis is a major setback.
But it will not result in any meaningful change.
I am a 56 year old small business owner. I have worked in my own business for 30 years. I am watching the teachers in my neighborhood retire around me at age 55, eager to live off the largess of the State for 30 years, while I will probably be working far into the forseable future.
We have created a bloated and unsustainable public employee benefit system in this State. As people and business’s flood out of New York it will be interesting to see if a State can function economically when the only people living there are public employees, union construction workers on prevailing wage State projects and, oh yes, the gutless politicians that were willing to ride the State down that change it before it was late.
Thanks, Tom, for doing all you could. Last one out shut off the lights.
After 22 years of paying insane taxes, I left New York too. I will never regret my decision. The money I have saved in taxes has paid for my youngest child’s college education, allowed me to make more generous charitable donations, and given me a small taste of financial freedom. It is a pitiful statement, but I was paying more in property tax than most millionaires in other states. I am certainly no millionaire and my very ordinary home was no mansion. I now own 2 house in 2 different states, and my property taxes are still only 1/3 what they were in New York!
On a comparison level, I’ve yet to figure out what I was receiving for all those excess taxes. New York services and schools are no different than those from other states. My children were no more prepared for college than children from other states - in some instances they were less prepared, so the “wonderful schools” arguement doesn’t hold water. The roads are no better, the community services are no different, and the standard of living is no higher. Maybe we expatriots should demand our tax money back, but New York is so poorly managed, I doubt they could figure out where even one penny of it went to. What has happened to New York is a shame. I hope the state can turn it around.
It’s time to get rid of both political parties in this state. The’re both clinging onto the idea that they can tax their way out of any situation. The answer is smaller government not more of it, eliminate bureaucracys like the Truway authority and take back our schools from the teacher unions. Get our government out of the healthcare business. Cut taxes and attract business back to the Empire State. Cut New York city loose to be their own separet state and become more like southern states who are attracting business instead of driving them away. What is our state government thinking when they chase business leaders out of our state like Golistano? I wonder where their heads are, wait a minute, I think I already know the answer to that question.
This is a strong, bold statement and the utterly disfunctional NY state and local governments should take notice (this means YOU, Silver, Bloomberg, Patterson, etc..). My wife and I are now planning to leave NY City as well due to the ever-increasing tax burden (Bloomberg has raised property taxes, the sales tax, the income tax, etc.. while the state gov has piled on too). Why bother staying here when, if your income is portable, you can go elsewhere and enjoy a much higher standard of living and not have to deal with the sheer incompetence of the politicians here? It never ceases to amaze me how citizens of this state continue elect politicians who have not even the most basic grasp of economics OR of the basic concept of how INCENTIVES DRIVE BEHAVIOR. Raise taxes on business and individuals to the highest combined rates in the country? Well, then don’t be surprised if no new businesses want to locate here. And don’t be surprised when people start leaving for greener pastures.
OK, I’m behind the one and only hope we have of fixing NY, that actually seems to understand it.
So, can we expect a “Governor Galisano” in the near future? Please give this thought some serious consideration Tom.
Even though I was born and raised in Rochester, along with several generations, I would love to leave this state with its ridiculous taxes.
I can’t leave until my children are out of school. As soon as that happens, I will start packing and join the masses.
The corrupt government in this state can continue to turn NY into a welfare state with a bloated public workforce…
I will watch from afar and remember the beauty of NY - maybe make a few trips from time to time in the summer. I suppose tourism may be the only private sector business that has a chance of surviving.
It is very sad.
Tom,
I can’t believe that you’re “being forced away from your family and friends”. If you’re going to save $5 million a year in taxes, chances are your life style can certainly accommodate your tax bill. Most of us can not afford to live in extravagant homes in Mendon and own a second home on Canandaigua Lake. We’re lucky to be able to visit the finger lakes a couple times a year. Yet you get to own property and spend as much time as you’d like enjoying one of New York’s natural gems. Pardon me if I can’t scrape together much sympany for your situation.
These days people are looking for hope. Their pensions have tanked, they’re loosing their jobs, they’re going without health insurance and they worry that their children won’t be able to go to college. Your email is not only irritating, but leaves me with yet another reminder of political corruption, hopelessness and greed.
Thanks, Tom…….
Bravo! More power to you. I wish we were all in the same position to make a move.
NY City must be made a Federal City, like DC. This state can no longer afford to support the crumbling infrastructure of “The City” let alone the other billions of dollars of problems created down state. With the current state executive people running NYC as a separate entity, perhaps the rest of us could find leadership to run the state of NY for the people.
Bravo Tom, New York will miss your wisdom .
For whoever mentioned making a federal city. I absolutely do not wish to fund NYC. I like to visit nice place but you live there you pay for it.
Secondly I live in a state that does have reasonable property taxes, reasonable income taxes and reasonable sales taxes. I believe I pay a fair share and do not get upset. Your schools are at the lower end of scale, roads and infastructure are acceptable.
My point is why do we always have to move the arguement to we have the best schools or best roads. When will we look at a student and say go to school and learn. No the classroom has to be a certain temp. and do not mark their paper in red because it will traumatize them. While our state may be low on the list for those who wanted to succed they did. Current Fed Chairman and current head of NASA to name a a couple.
All our public schools do is make it easy for kids to fail. Yes mine go to Private School. So I actually pay twice to make sure they have a shot. However, they will tell you that I have told them I am only giving them a shot. They can fail in life just as easily if they do not do it themselves
WOW never do this and that felt good
I totally support Tom. It is amazing how compliant most New Yorkers have become. The lesson of higher taxes is no more abundantly clear than here in New York: Higher taxes produce worse results, not better! Witness our school system and the stats he cited. The highest per student spend in the nation and absolutely horrendous results. I just hope we can get some courageous, honest politicians to take bold, necessary, and at this point, drastic action to prevent the state from going beyond the tipping point…that is, when enough wealthy citizens like Tom leave, and there are more voters who are takers from, than contributors to, the state spending budget. It’s not only wealthy individuals, it’s industries that are fleeing this oppressively expensive state. Now we see even traditional tax-and-spend liberals like Cuomo, saying that we need to cut costs. Let’s be sure to examine the actual records of politicians, though, when choosing candidates next time around. And until then, we all should be flooding our elected officials’ emails and voice mails with messages, imploring them to take immediate action to slash spending, and to incent business investment in New York State.
I am a member of a New York State union and I did vote against supporting New York’s tax increases. There are union members who realize that we must do more with less in this state.
Good going Tom!! You worked hard for your money and don’t deserve to be raped by the fools in Albany.
I would rather see this whole system collapse then to have our our state and nation turn into a socialistic dictatorship. May all the (evil) rich in this state wise up and leave, sending a devestating, but needed, message to the Governor that they won’t support the government’s travisties of greedy spending anymore.
Freedom is costly, but worth the cost.
I completely agree with Mr. Tom Golisano.
Please keep up the fight.
Good luck Tom! I also love NY, I was born here, my parents were born here and my life is here. I even moved back after I got out of the military. I wish you nothing but the best, and hope you remember us New Yorkers in your rear-view mirror.
Thanks for doing what you do for this state and its people,one thing is all the attention that you bring to what they are doing up in albany, Big fat nothing!
My movers are arriving Monday afternoon, and I will soon be on my way to sunny New Mexico! New York is too expensive. It also has god-awful air quality–one in four children in Harlem have asthma, but our mayor didn’t support the commuter tax, which has been proven to improve air quality and reduce traffic in other cities. He did however use taxpayer dollars to build giant sports stadiums while cutting service and raising fares on the MTA. And with global warming, New York is beginning to develop a rainy and dreary climate, sort of like a warmer London. Yuck. I’m outta here.
Thank you Mr. Golisano!
We live in Rochester and we are leaving NYS too. Our annual income is less than 50k but we did our homework, visited another state and saved money.
Did I mention that my husband lost his job and my job will be leaving in a few months–to another state!. Talk about incentive! It seems the jobs that are available are the ones that prefer to hire people on welfare so employers only pay a portion of their wages. Government pays the other portion.
My sister’s family is leaving for the south next week. My nephew will start 10th grade down there. We are leaving for the south next month with eight more family members to follow within 12 months.
We were all born and raised here but just can’t take it any more…
Companies like Paychex that increase productivity also destroy good paying jobs, which is great if everyone shares the gains from the boost in productivity, but terrible if the increased productivity only goes to a few people. Then the economy shuts down from cash-flow issues as other people struggle with the losses of jobs and revenue. Capitalism can’t work humanely if capital is too centralized. The people in NYS would not have so many problems paying taxes if the the wealth from exponentially increasing automation was shared, like through a basic income like Daniel Patrick Moynihan and Richard Nixon proposed in the 1970s. Conventional economics denies this problem, arguing there is always a need for more jobs, but the fact is that demand is limited for more stuff beyond a certain point for healthy people, because the best things in life are free or cheap. Tom’s generous gifts to people studying sustainability at RIT may eventually help more people understand this basic fact about productivity and jobs and sharing the wealth through a basic income. See wikipedia for related information. Unions fight for better pay and benefits, but only for specific workers, not for everyone. Public schools redistribute wealth somewhat, but then use it badly, to, as NYS teacher of the year John Taylor Gatto say, dumb down kids for factory jobs that don’t exist anymore. So, that’s why those efforts have just harmed NYS. A more general basic income would be better than those specific programs. NYS’s failure is just the beginning; this problem will spread nationally and then globally as productivity continues to rise from clever entrepreneurs like Tom and as demand become saturated. Marshall Brain talks about this in Manna and Robotic Nation.
I don’t know which one is worse, California or New York State. Who has time to conduct business and make money when you have to spend all your time fighting tax audits, notices and assessments issued after the statute has run. Hint — fill out every underpayment penalty form no matter how much you are overpaid for the tax year. I’d like to invest in a moving business because there will be a stampede of individuals and business trying to escape these thieving states.
I recently graduated and am looking for a job anywhere but in NY. It’s sad, because this has been my home for years, and my friends and family are here. But like you, I will no longer support this corrupt, bloated, doomed political machine in Albany. Like a drug addict, they need an intervention, and those who have been enabling their selfish destructive habits need to pull the plug on them. The recent dog-and-pony show played out in the Albany assembly only served to convince me that to stay here is useless. Sorry, NY–you may go down the toilet, but I’m not going with you.
In 1991 the NYS Business Council advertised for anyone to submit their ideas on how to improve Govt services AND reduce costs. I submitted some 14 separate suggestions including in-depth explanations. Gov Cuomo adopted the RF-ID tolls collection system (EZ-Pass), the ‘Zipper’ (moveable concrete barrier system on the Tappanzee Bridge) and the use of epoxy coated steel rebar in the construction of concrete infrastructure (to eliminate galvanic corrosion leading to fractured concrete, pot-holes and frost heaves).
Here are a few links to examples of what ‘Responsible Government’ can accomplish.
http://www.fixmystreet.com/
http://www.springwise.com/government/
http://www.springwise.com/government/mmsing_local_government_update/
Since its construction in the 1960s one intersection along Interstate 84 (passing through Orange, Dutchess and Putnam counties) had been the scene of an average of 1 crash every 3 days. The NYSDOT laid the blame each time on ‘driver error’ - yet even their own Commissioner admitted the design of the intersection was largely at-fault in his letter to (now Senator) John Bonacic when he closed his letter with “And for your information .. the redesign of the intersection will alleviate the crashes which have been occurring there”.
Though this amounts to a signed admission of guilt - NYS’ legal system (note I didn’t write ‘justice’ system) denies injured parties their 5th and 14th Amendment ‘rights’ to due process and equal protection of law in claiming compensation for medical expenses, lost wages and suffering. While negligent employees of private firms may face lawsuits up to 5 years after causing injury - those employed in the civil service sector are shielded by an arbitrary and capricious statute of limitations of a mere 3 months. Little wonder conditions in NYS continue to spiral downward due to this lack of accountability institutionalized by the Assembly and Senate.
This intersection’s defective design was allowed to exist for nearly 30 years - causing injury, disability and (in some cases) death to thousands of innocent motorists while NYSDOT officials quietly tallied-up these statistics as evidence in their application for grants for federal highway funding. Not 20 miles west of this location they had constructed another intersection (at the same time) with a visual barrier (an earthen berm with trees and shrubs) which is STILL serving to prevent crashes.
Only a state Constitutional Convention will enable ordinary voters to place an issue up for vote - and such a measure IS essential to limit political candidates to taxpayer financed campaign funding so political party bosses cannot exercise anymore influence over lawmakers’ policy decisions than the average voter.
We are just settling into our beautiful new North Carolina home where our property taxes dropped to $2,400 - from $11,000 we were paying in Orange County.
I think I deserve a new Rolex for making such a smart move lol!
Please Mr. G ,save the state that you love .Run for govenor , We would all vote for you !!! cause we love n.y. too!!!
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